cerberus fighter invention discussion

[tec_server]

first design:

[Lou of East from West]

100/3=34*2=68 mp for a cruiser?
but he got spectre, lol
200/3=68*2=136 mp for warcruiser?
u unfortunally he got 2 dreds...
...
there is too many of this stuff!!!!!

_________________
Duke Lou
MoC of 9

[Liderant]

maybe if it does 4 damage

[Username]

yes you are right lou but this ship is like the sabotage fighter and you need 70 sabotage to destroy 7 destroyers that are 56 points
also if you have enough creberus (a lot of cerberus) you will kill the dreadnoughts and cyclopses before they can act

[masterp]

yeah lou is right the ceberous needs a bit more power mp +1/2


Greetings

[Username]

I am the creator of this ship and I must say that I make a mistake calculating the power of this ship, making a comparision whit the sabotage I see this:
150 sabotage can kill 15 destroyers wining 120 point whit 150 mp invested
68 cerberus can kill 2 cruisers wining 120 points whit only 136 mp invested

so we can see that this ship is unbalanced compared whit the sabotage because you can win more points whit less mp invested

but there is a way to fix this:
instead of deal 3 damage: deal 4 damage
instead of 2 mp: 3 mp

this way the calculation up ahead will remain this way:

150 sabotage wins 120 points, like before
50 cercerus wins the same 120 points of the sabotage and cost 150 mp

also we can see that this ship (cerberus 1.1)deals 4 damage whit 3 mp (1.25 damage per mp unit) and the sabotage deals 1 damage per mp unit and the cerberus 1.0 (the original version) deals 1,5 damage per mp unit

but also there are more things to see:
the 2 versions of cerberus have a drawback against sabotage and is that have the same lp whit more mp, this means that an enemy fighter kills 1 sabotage and gets 1 point but against a cerberus will win 2 or 3 points (depends of the version) so the cerberus (both versions) are more vulnerable against class1 ships
also another drawback of the cerberus is that like 75 % of the class 2 ships have 10 lp and the other ships have less than 10 lp so if you see an enemy fleet in a dsp you can calculate how many sabotage you will need, this way you can limit the lost if something goes wrong but in the class 3 ships there are ships that have more than 100 lp, even 500 lp so you can't calculate how many cerberus you will need like how you can do whit the sabotage

so at the end I am not sure what version of my creation is more balanced,
the cerberus 1.0 (3 damage for 2 mp)
cerberus 1.1 (4 damage for 3 mp)
or another option somebady want to say

by the way: I want to know if I wrote the name correctly, in spanish is called ''cancerbero'', is the 3 heads dog guardian of the hell in the greeks mithology, if somebady knows if is right or wrong please post the answer here

[Achilles]

Cerberus is the three-headed dog who guards Tartarus, the city of the dead.

I was dipped in the river Styx as a child, which is nearby.

[JaM]

I like this ship, but I think it needs to do more damage.

[Username]

I see another detail of this ship, the first version have something I don't before and is that no ship destroyed can be reconstructed because never does exact damage
well this make that the first cerberus version can't be so now only remain the second version (4 damage for 3 mp)

[Passchendaele]

I don't like it. By attacking class three directly there is a greater potential for damage than class two.

"150 sabotage can kill 15 destroyers wining 120 point whit 150 mp invested
68 cerberus can kill 2 cruisers wining 120 points whit only 136 mp invested "

Sure, the points add up, but there is a big difference between 15 destroyers and 2 cruisers. The two cruisers make up a larger part of the class three than the destroyers of class two.

Example, class three battle:
10 cruisers= 340 cerberus 1.0 --A bargain at 680 mp.
10 cruisers= 250 cerberus 1.1 --750 mp.

Class two:
100 destroyers= 1000 sabotage --1000 mp.

Without looking at the points totals, you are looking at taking large chunks out of class three, because class three is smaller than class two by nature. Even 40 class three ships can be dealt with by only 1000 cerberus 1.1, at a cost of 3000 mp. But a 400 ship class two would take 4000 sabotage to clear.

This is just my opinion, but I think that it would leave class four too vulnerable by implementing this ship.

If there is anything wrong with my math let me know.

_________________
"We died in hell, they called it Passchendaele."
- Soldiers Lament, WWI

[Username]

well Passchendaele your math is not wrong, and your point neither but there is a problem

ssabotage
30 destroyers = 300 mp in sabotage = 240 point

cerberus
should be
3 cruiser = 300 mp in cerberus = 180 points
OR...
4 cruisers = 300 mp in cerberus = 240 points

so now we have a dilema
(the cerberus 3 damage for 2 mp is unbalanced, so forget it)

1 damage per 1 mp OR 4 damage per 3 mp?

I like more 4 damage per 3 mp and I think is balanced because this ship is very vulnerable to class 1 ships because cost 3 mp and have only 1 lp like the sabotage

but I want to listen everybady opinion

[Username]

Ups, I forget to say something, sorry

[Passchendaele]

That does change things quite a bit. I never fought against sabotage fighters, or built any for that matter.

I'll have to think on this one a bit more.

_________________
"We died in hell, they called it Passchendaele."
- Soldiers Lament, WWI

[JaM]

Strange br, I think if the class 2 is empty you should have class 2 vs class 3 battle because the sabotages destroyed the 4 destroyers. I had the same problem last round, still don't know if it is a bug of a feature.

[Username]

I also think that, thats why I have in the br 100 destroyers, to attack his class 3 after my sabotage fighters clean his class 2

I don't think is a bug, otherwise the sabotage will be too powerfull

[admin]

the ship is added, so i opened a new post with the revised version:
http://www.spacetrace.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=45622